"The Joe Rogan Experience" is a popular, if sometimes controversial, podcast by American comedian and wrestling commentator Joe Rogan, which was launched in 2009.

Rogan has hosted countless celebrity guests over the years, including Elon Musk, Bernie Sanders, Edward Snowden and President Donald Trump. He has also spoken with many scientists, show stars, musicians, and wrestling and martial arts stars.

Now Rogan had Magnus Carlsen as a guest. In a long conversation Carlsen spoke very openly about the beginning of his career, his joy in chess, when chess does not become an obsession and degenerate into work.

Carlsen revealed how his father taught him to play chess at the age of five, but he was more interested in Lego. At some point, however, the fiercely competitive young Magnus wanted to beat his sister at chess.

Carlsen began playing tournament chess at the age of 11 or 12, and mused that children nowadays start much earlier. In India he had seen a three-year-old playing "decent" chess and he was sure that Faustino Oro, the 11-year-old Argentinian talent, would soon become a grandmaster.

Early in the discussion Carlsen was asked about the controversy with Hans Niemann and how he came to the conclusion that Niemann had cheated during the tournament in Saint Louis with the help of a computer. Carlsen did not want to go into too much detail about this, as a documentary will soon be released on Netflix which will go into greater detail. However, Carlsen claimed that the quality of Niemann's play back then, his statements in joint analyses and his play against Carlsen did not match. 

Carlsen also admitted that players are becoming increasingly paranoid about the possibility of playing near-perfectly with powerful chess engines. He listed a number of cheating cases and explained how the cheating had been carried out.

Carlsen revealed that he still doesn't trust Niemann because his play contains too many peculiarities and that a number of other top players don't trust Niemann either. According to Carlsen, it is also noticeable that Niemann does not play at the same high level at very strict security checks as he does at lax security precautions.

In the course of the interview Carlsen explained what he thinks makes a good chess player and how much his parents and sisters helped him to create a pleasant family environment for his chess career. But he also talked about other great players and their paths: E.g. Alireza Firouzja, who has a fantastic intuition, which he gained by playing countless blitz games, sometimes even during training sessions, or the current World Champion Gukesh, who relied more on books and didn't play on the internet for a long time.

Carlsen explained how he used to play a lot on the internet under pseudonyms until someone from Russia sent him a message on a chess server saying that he knew all of Carlsen's anonymous accounts - and then proved this claim by sending them to Carlsen.

The Norwegian went on to explain the influence of computers on the development of opening theory, his passion for Freestyle chess and revealed his new hobby, golf.

It was a long conversation. Listen for yourself: